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Dervisan View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Cem Karaca (Turkish progressive master)
    Posted: February 02 2009 at 07:45



everything was started in 1967 with a song compitition ... "Altın mikrofon şarkı yarışması" (Golden microphone song contest)... he was join this contest with Apaşlar band which is a beat band... and same contest a lot of young beat music guys  join this contest who will make progressive pschedelic a few years later... this contest was the first that turkey discover it s honour,ability with their own lyrics own melodies and own language... Cem Karaca said that "we have all sing Elvis songs like a parrot before this contest" they have found theirselves and their ability...not only Cem Karaca; Erkin Koray(who is the biggest name of psyhedelic turkish) Moğollar - Les Mogol- , Barış Manço and the others..



Cem Karaca - Apaşlar win this contest with their song "Emrah" which is a old tradational folk song of anatolia with a beatnic sounds... After this song he have never left the anatolian tradational melodies....and  this is the first uprise of him..

Cem Karaca- Apaşlar / Emrah
  (1967)   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGx4e60qGQc

------------------------

ENGLİSH LYRİCS OF "EMRAH"

i have visited a sapling* at the earlier morning     *(sapling=young darling)
i asked "are you sad?"
she said "no, no"
"your white hands are all hennaed(*) " i asked "is there a wedding?"   (*)the girls make their hand hennaed in the fiestas,weddings in Turkey
she said "no, no"

i asked "what is pearl?"
she said "my teeths"
i asked "what is pencil?" (in turkey beautiful eyebrows called eyebrows like pencil)
she said "my eyebrows"
i asked "white breast?"
she said "on my chest"
i said "give them, i want kiss"
she said "no,no,"
nooooooooooooo

i asked "what is death?"
she said "on my neck"
i asked "come on, die with me"
she said "no,no"

i asked "what is death?"
she said "on my neck"
i asked "come on, die with me"
she said "noooooooooooooo"

------------------------


TO BE CONTİNUED Wink







Edited by Dervisan - February 22 2009 at 14:03
Turkish (Anatolian) Progressive Psychedelic Ethnical Rock
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2009 at 08:54
in this band they have used the tradational anatolian folk songs like "Hudey" "Karacoğlan" "Oy babo"  with beatnic melodies ...  bur he has started to make up his own songs like "resmideki gözyaşları" "bu son olsun" "zeyno"

and he and his band have played a lot of songs with FREDDY KLEIN ORCHESTRA  so we can named some songs semphonic beatnic rock...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8c0WYebOv5g (Ayrılık Günümüz)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHtyfK0KC0c (İstanbulu Dinliyorum)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mmYlnwc7oM (karacoğlan)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fa9uhGiG860 (zeyno)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jep3rmcjiLc (resimdeki gözyaşları) {tears on the photograph} (there is a english version of it named "tears" i will upload it to youtube soon)



-------------------------

ENGLİSH LYRİCS OF "RESİMDEKİ GÖZYAŞLARI"  {tears on the photograph}

maybe you are looking for a alleviation from the days that were past, from the life
look at my photograph, see the tears that were run out..

now you have got only a little photograph from me
it cant answer you but it can cry for your alone

and i have got only a few memory in my palm
you leave me alone and gone

maybe you are looking for a alleviation from the days that were past, from the life
look at my photograph

you are not alone, i know where you are
it might make you sad, if you are living and see this

maybe you are looking for a alleviation from the days that were past, from the life
look at my photograph, see the tears that were run out..

-----------------------------

that you see this band was not using the progressive sound yet... and otherwise they didnt use rock sound too sometimes... however he has won a lot of popularity in turkey but Cem Karaca was looking for more hard band to make real rock...he didnt want to make beatnic music so the Apaşlar band was demolished at the begining 1971...

Then he establish a new band called : CEM KARACA - KARDAŞLAR ( Cem Karaca and the brothers)

it was the begining of progressive folk sounds of Cem Karaca





Edited by Dervisan - February 02 2009 at 20:32
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2009 at 10:34
he has changed his music after establish the Cem Karaca-Kardaşlar.. you can see this change if you listen them after the links that i gave last message



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yya8xPVW5mw (Kendim ettim kendim buldum)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NU0KRn8hA1g (Adsız)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSCjYtQmBj0 (Muhtar)

they were the first song of Cem Karaca - Kardaşlar ... (there is a song named "emmioğlu" but i cant find a link about it)  now cem karaca shows his wonderful and powerful voice more than before and his band make more hard rock...

they were the transition period from semphonic beatnic to progressive folk

then he made a new song ;  it was the song that the citizens of turkey expect... with this song he was in 1. place for a long time in the lists... it was the ; "DADALOGLU" ..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7epYeDf0IY    (Dadaloğlu)


it was the story of a hero that a turkish rebel against the Ottomans .. so this song was really loved because in that time there is really terrible repressive managment because of  soviet russia and USA  cold war.. and this song was telling the feelings of turkishs.. because they didnt want to live with this repressive ... so turkey was a continue of ottomans ...

this song was played with turkish tradational instruments and Cem Karaca's vokals like opera... (it is reallt strange that ;the productor of the band was really angry when he listened this song he didnt want to publish this song but Cem Karaca pressed him so this song is already listened in turkey nowSmile )

now Cem Karaca was known by everyone in Turkey and his songs were singing in all tongues









Edited by Dervisan - February 02 2009 at 20:33
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2009 at 11:38
and now he has finished his transition period ... he hasnt done beatnic after "Dadaloğlu" and he started to do pure "Progressive Psychedelic Folk Rock" after this transition period (after "dadaloğlu") and Cem Karaca - Kardaşlar have started to make new songs ;


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6JlnO7lC78  (Tatlı Dillim)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-fULlQF2ok  (Kara Yılan)

but in this time the most important song was "Acı Doktor" ... it was the tradational song by a troubadour named Aşık Mahsuni Şerif who was the rebel politikal name of Turkey ... (so Cem Karaca have made a lot of songs with him) Cem Karaca - Kardaşlar was played this song really pschedelic paraphrase and it was really experimental song...

http://rapidshare.com/files/155880750/Cem_Karaca_Kardaslar_Aci_Doktor.rar   (Acı Doktor)

this song told about a poor man with his sick baby... he go to a doctor and say "i havent got money, give my jacket" for his baby's ameliorate... really impressive subject that i said... and they can use it with really good pschedelic sound...

   

(THERE ARE SOME SONGS TOO BUT İ COULDNT FİND ANY LİNKS TO SHOW THEM, SO İ WİLL WRİTE ALL DİSCOGRAPHY.. YOU WİLL SEE THESE SONGS IN THERE.. NOW ONLY İ WANT TO TELL THE WAY TO PURE PROGRESSİVE ROCK WITH EXAMPLES)










Edited by Dervisan - February 14 2009 at 11:50
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2009 at 12:27
But after them, Cem Karaca wanted to make more politikal and more rock thing.. and he couldnt do this with KARDAŞLAR... Cem Karaca was interested with socializm and marxism these days and he was really thinking like a village socialist...

in these days the biggest band of turkish progressive ; MOĞOLLAR (they were known as LES MOGOL - they have won the ACADEMİC CHARLES CROSS award before PINK FLOYD and after JIMI HENDRIX so thınk theır importance in France) was looking for a vocalist to their band so they wanted to work with Cem Karaca ... it was really wonderfull wedding... they have made three 45rpm but in this period the important song was "Namus Belası" ....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1LsnkRPcRE   (Namus Belası)

i love this song becuase i can feel the moğollar sound and cem karaca's vokal is really wonderful...and it s a Cem Karaca song he wrote the lyrics and melodies.. maybe cem karaca have started to make wonderful songs after this song...



other Cem Karaca/MOĞOLLAR SONGS ;

http://www.imeem.com/esensn/music/u84Jtt0n/cem_karaca_edali_geln/  (Edalı Gelin)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLVSxmNYiVQ (Üzüm Kaldı)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KY4eyUtBMrQ&feature=related  (ihtarname)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oiZ_fB8ML_4  (Obur Dünya)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbwONIty-ws  (İhtiyar Oldum)   i loooveeeee this soonnnggggg

---------------------

ENGLİSH LYRICS OF "IHTIYAR OLDUM"

why did i become an old man before i have borned from my mother
 before i was 7 year old , i have became an old man
i have became an old man i have became an old man

you make me a subject of a gossip
you promised me and abdicate
you make me a subject of a gossip
you promised me and abdicate
my darling you can be happy
i have become an old man

Doctor dont be sad because of me
i never touch your medicines
my black hairs have become white
i have become an old man

-------------------------

i think this song is most important song of Cem Karaca/ Moğollar becasue Moğollar was really masters of anatolian progressive folk and Cem Karaca too ... and they could make a wonderful progressive folk music with this Aşık Mahsuni Şerif's tradational song...


and there is a one song more.. it was really like middle east's arabesque;  "Gel gel"  and a few  later cem karaca will be kidding with this song in his  song named "ihtarname" with same band

and then Cahit Berkay who is the biggest name of MOĞOLLAR went to France to make an international album so this Cem Karaca-Moğollar band was demolished in early 1974 ...

after that the biggest band of turkish rock history ;DERVİSAN will be established ... my heart beat so hard when i say this name LOL i love this band .. you can understand it if you see my nick name Big smile pure progressive sound will wait you Wink








Edited by Dervisan - February 22 2009 at 15:47
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2009 at 14:51
Cem Karaka were proposed and rejected in 2006, though they can of course be considered again.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2009 at 15:02

at first not karaka , karaca ...  sorry but who reject it i really want to know.. or are the people who reject him or others  know Cem Karaca or the others??? or not???? if it s not, i never be suprised...

but "replikas" is here..if the members of replikas's  see this, they will really smile for this... yes replikas is a good band i like them too but not more than Cem Karaca, Erkin Koray or the other masters...

if they dont know i am telling him .. and i will tell the others .. they will accept or not.. if i can reach 1 person it s wonderful for me... but i want their honour alrready... so he is not my father... but he is the biggest musician i have ever heard...

wait and continue to listen... if you want absolutely...


Edited by Dervisan - February 02 2009 at 15:11
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2009 at 16:23
after Cem Karaca-Moğollar band, he has tried to establish a progressive band so he has establish DERVİSAN which is the best progressive band of Turkey (already the best rock band)

this band's member were really master of their instrument.. i want to tell you 3 musicians that i love from this band;

Ugur dikmen (keyboard) ; he was played in "assia minor mission" in norway and he has really graduate in scandinavia progressive.. and he has got really wonderful ability and i think he was better than a lot of keyboards that you know(for example ; emerson, i have got a lot of concert record so listen and see)

Oğuz Durukan (BASS) ; he was played in "assia minor mission" in norway and he has really graduate in scandinavia progressive..

Hüseyin Sultanoğlu
(drum) ; he is my rock ikon... he has played in BUNALIMLAR which is the god of turkish psychedelic... he has the best drummer i have ever seen... and best rocker too...




in earlier Cem Karaca - DERVİSAN , there is a song that was played with KARDAŞLAR period.. "BEYAZ ATLI" it was the new prog version of this song... (there isnt any link about beyaz atlı, i will upload it to you tube soon) but the other song of 45 rpm' is "yiğitler"

"Yiğitler" is a tradational song and i think it was the worst song of Dervisan but Hüseyin Sultanoğlu(drummer) is wonderful in this song.. i listen it only for it..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hzz_7vIG-R4   (Yiğitler)

it was the earlier Cem Karaca - Dervisan

after this 45 rpm the biggest bomb of turkish rock music was explode ;

"TAMİRCİ ÇIRAĞI" (apprentice of repairman) it has droped like a bomb on turkey and it was really wonderful progressive  masterwork and this was the only begining...

 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtGpYYyGOkI     (Tamirci çırağı)

-----------

ENGLİSH LYRİCS OF "TAMİRCİ ÇIRAĞI" (apprentice of repairman) -its really hard but i will try-

a fire has dropped in my heart
expectation is the bread of my heard, wish and wish
her hands are white,beautiful,nail polished
where can he hide his colluses of his palm?

she has come to repaired her car to our maintenance hall (repair shop)
i have shotted and falled in love when i saw her
the long skirts on her legs and curly hairs
my adept have called me "son, bring the set of tools"

i have read a subject like this in a novel
it was crystalline and expensive novel book
how can it i dont know but the girl love the boy
in a same situation, to the apprentice of repairman

i said my adept "let me, i wont dress my overalls"
i have draged my hairs in non smooth mirror
she will come  to take her car back
to make real this dream in novel maybe
the time was stopped
the world was stopped
she was comming in from the door
i have standed in bewilderment that i cant separate my eyes
i have opened the door,
i have opened she can come in
her eyebrows were rise up
and asked ; "WHO IS THIS VARGANT"

she has gone away with her car,
i have stifle in her cars exhaust gas
the tear drops on my eyes, i have rise up slowly
my adept have come and hit my back friendly
and said ; "YOU ARE A WORKER, BE A WORKER, DRESS YOUR OVERALLS"
"YOU ARE A WORKER, BE A WORKER, DRESS YOUR OVERALLS"
"YOU ARE A WORKER, BE A WORKER, DRESS YOUR OVERALLS"

---------------------

dont forget to listen this song when read the lyrics.. (video was from a movie "AĞIR ROMAN" i love this movie too )

After this song the turkish people are still feels like silly when they listen it because it s done everyday...

the other song of this 45 rpm is "nerdesin" it was an anatolian folk rock song ( i couldnt find a link about it) and it s not important beside "tamirci çırağı" Tongue





ugur dikmen - hüseyin sultanoğlu - cem karaca - oğuz durukan



Edited by Dervisan - February 15 2009 at 18:42
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2009 at 17:56
after this 45 rpm Cem Karaca - Dervisan began to make songs with more political and more progressive... and they have published "NEM KALDI" LP ... in this new LP there was a 2 new songs (others are old records)

1.Nem Kaldı
2.Unutamadığım

at first i have to tell "unutamadığım" it is the second best progressive song of Cem Karaca Dervisan (you will see the best later) this is a poem of a turkish modern poet Ahmet Arif... and sorry but this song was wonderful than a lot of song in your progarscives list...let s listen ;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3gMQ_MmPx8  (UNUTAMADIĞIM)

the record is terrible in this link ... and there is no link about this song :(

"nem kaldı" was a tradational song from Aşık Mahsuni Şerif and Dervisan make it really good prog song..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iy5To6zBpDg   (nem kaldı) 

song is deficient in this lin :( there is no more link...  ok what ever ...


cem karaca - hüseyin sultanoğlu

after this LP they published a new LP named ; "beni siz delirttiniz" "niyazi" i wish to show you "niyazi" but i cant now because there is no link about it...

and the third bomb ; "PARKA" LP was published in 1977 ... there was 2 new songs in this LP 1.PARKA 2.KAVGA

"PARKA" was one of the best progressive rock song of the Cem Karaca-Dervisan

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xw-V5z_bxC8  (PARKA)

this song has told about a university student that was shotted 3 times with his parka because of his political minds... all band members have played their instrument wonderful and they made really wonderful progressive song....it s same for the second new song ; "KAVGA"(fight)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwsTp_-7Z4M   (KAVGA) (fight) means fight with fashists

these song are sign that they have started to use very heavy political argue because in these days there are a inside war against socialist and fashists... and Cem Karaca-Dervisan was select its side...

After this LP they have published  the best progressive rock album of turkey ( with barıs manco's "2023" and "yeni bir gün" ; Erkin koray s "Electronik türküler")  YOKSULLUK KADER OLAMAZ (the poorness can not be a destiny)

..."YOKSULLUK KADER OLAMAZ" is the best rock and progressive album i have ever listened...










Edited by Dervisan - February 22 2009 at 14:24
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2009 at 19:49
"YOKSULLUK KADER OLAMAZ" LP include new songs all ..wonderful new songs... AND BELEİVE ME THİS ALBUM İS ONE OF THE BEST ALBUM İN PROGRESSİVE ROCK HİSTORY TOO...

1.Kerem Gibi (i couldnt find any link) :(
2.Bir Ögretmene Ağıt (i couldnt find any link)
3.Adiloş Bebe
4.İşçi Marşı (i couldnt find any link) :((((
5.Maden Ocağının Dibinde
6.Sevdan beni
7.Vay Kurban (i couldnt find any link)
8.Yoksulluk Kader Olamaz  (i couldnt find any link)

but i have upload the best progressive song of turkey and so you can listen it Wink  it s; "SEVDAN BENİ" 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcL4XFy1Or8 (SEVDAN BENİ)

it is a poem of Ahmed Arif who is a most famous political and modern poet of Turkey... this song is the best progressive song of turkey's musical history (i think like that)  i cant say anymore... only listen please...

.............silence



 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKNjohQICps (maden ocağının dibinde) it s the another song from this LP but record is really bad in this link... i will upload it later again myself... or i will upload all this album... because you have to listen them...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ApY4otxCq8&feature=PlayList&p=1FADA1F57B35850F&playnext=1&index=15   (Adiloş Bebe)   

it s another wonderful song from this album... it s a poem from Ahmed Arif too... so listen Smile

i will upload other songs soon.. ok??



 

Edited by Dervisan - February 02 2009 at 20:39
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2009 at 20:19
Turkey political situation have gone really terrible... the people killed eachother because of their political minds in everywhere ... and Cem Karaca Dervisan have started to hav more heavy political argue... and after this wonderful LP they have made a new 45 rpm called : "Mor Perşembe" and "Bir Mirasyediye Ağıt"

these songs were done for "yoksulluk kader olamaz" LP but 10 song could be more for a one album so they were published after this LP.. so they are wonderful 2 songs too... exactly  i love "bir mirasyediye ağıt"



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX4PmEQdYpQ  (Bir Mirasyediye Ağıt)

i couldnt find any link about "Mor perşembe" :( :(

İ am fixing my webpage.. when i finish it you can listen all online... only give me some time... not only Cem Karaca.. you will see the others too Wink

the last 45rpm of Dervisan is really so heavy politikal songs and i think they didnt think music in these 45 rpm and Cem Karaca said that "we have done this 45  rpm not like a musician we have done it like a fight men"



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEptwH_PWWA
  (1 Mayıs)  {march of 1 May}

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRkDA3crZD0  (Durduramayacaklar halkın coskun akan selini) {thay cant stopped the calamity of public

so cem karaca will go out of the country because of this 45 rpm after 1980 military coup and he could back here a long time later...


After this album Dervisan was demolished because of their heavy political argue they meet with some death threats... and they thought it was the best that to stopped it.....

But Cem Karaca didnt be empty and establish a new band called ; EDİRDAHAN

and have made an album with this band ; "safinaz"







Edited by Dervisan - February 02 2009 at 20:30
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2009 at 20:28
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2009 at 03:10
A side note for those who may be concerned: Cem Karaca's second band Kardaslar included the multi instrumentalist (guitar, saz, iklig*) Alexander Wiska, who is somewhat well-known in Krautrock circles by his Alex Oriental Experience band! (at least the first two records of this band relied heavily on Turkish culture, also with a helping hand from Can members Holger Czukay, JakiLiebezeit & Michael Karoli!) In fact, a later compilation of Alex Oriental Experience includes Cem Karaca's first single with Kardaslar: "Dadaloglu / Kalender". Alex plays the heck out of Iklig in this record!

* (iklig is a Turkish traditional bowed instrument, much smaller than a violin, with 3 strings [if I'm not mistaken]. Another Turkish Psych-Ethnic Rock band Mogollar made great use of this instrument in their groundbreaking 1971 album "Danses et Rythmes de la Turquie-d'Hier d'Aujourd'hui" [renamed in Turkey as "Anadolu Pop"], including an eponymous track, in which the instrument made a prominent appearance...)

P.S. in Turkish ortography, the letter "C" is always pronounced as "J", or soft "G". So, Cem Karaca should be read somewhat like  "Gem Kah-rah-jah" Tongue
Listen to Turkish psych/prog; you won't regret:
Baris Manco,Erkin Koray,Cem Karaca,Mogollar,3 Hürel,Selda,Edip Akbayram,Fikret Kizilok,Ersen (and Dadaslar) (but stick with the '70's, and 'early 80's!)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2009 at 03:24
Sevdan Beni'nin harika bir parça olduğunu tartışmam; ama "en iyi" mi dersen, orada durup beklerim işte Wink. Erkin'in Mesafeler'i var, Türkü'sü var; Barış'ın 2023'ü, 2024'ü, hatta 2025'i var, aha da bir Gönül Dağı var ; daha da aha yukarıda koca bi Safinaz var Smile Moğollar'ı ve '70'lerin ilk yarısında (77'ye kadar diyelim) frıtına gibi parçalar yapan Edip Akbayram'ı da unutmayalım. Hatta zorlasam Sevenler Ağlarmış'ı (Haluk Levent'in sçıp sıvadığını değil, orijinal versiyonu LOL) bie bu listeye koyabilirim... Bence "en iyi" demek bizi aşar. hepsi ayrı güzel Wink...

(bu arada Tamirci Çırağı iyi şarkı olmakla birlikte, progressive mrogressive değildir bana göre... İhtarname, Parka, hatta Nem Kaldı bile çok daha progressive bence...)

iyi bari, albüm bazında Elektronik Türküler'le 2023'ün ve  Yeni Bir Gün'ün hakkını vermişsin Big smile gerçi ben Nedir Ne Değildir'i de eklerdim... Ama en iyi progressive grup deyince, Dervişan'a saygımız sonsuz olmakla birlikte, Kurtalan'ı tek geçerim... Bunun sırrı da, elemanlarının müzik yeteneklerinden çok Barış'ın multi-enstrümentalist ve düzenleme dehası olması, daha da önemlisi kendi tarzına uygun yetenekleri sağdan-soldan cımbızla çekip bir araya getiren müthiş bir yeteneğinin olması! Yani şunu demek istiyorum; progressive'lik büyük ölçüde "teknik"e bağlı bir olay olduğundan, Barış'ın '70'li yılları (yani Kurtalan'ın altın çağı) bu konuda her zaman önde olmuş... tabi bu "daha iyi" oldukları anlamına gelmiyor; Cem Karaca'yı da öne çıkaran başka faktörler var, hangisinin daha iyi olduğu kişiden kişiye değişir...
Listen to Turkish psych/prog; you won't regret:
Baris Manco,Erkin Koray,Cem Karaca,Mogollar,3 Hürel,Selda,Edip Akbayram,Fikret Kizilok,Ersen (and Dadaslar) (but stick with the '70's, and 'early 80's!)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2009 at 03:48

^ could you repeat that in English please Bilek?

What?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2009 at 07:15
thanx bilek; i have forgot to talk about alex wiska... becuase i didnt talk about the members of any bands.. but it is true we have to talk about him becuase he was the musician that didnt know anything about turkish prog folk and he was a German street musician before Kardaşlar.. Cem Karaca have met with him in a street, saw his abiliti and bring him to turkey suddenly to his band Kardaşlar... it was really strange that act really.. but Cem Karaca didnt think false because he was really succesful in Kardaşlar...

yes it s true that we have to talk about a song that  Alex Wiska's  in Cem Karaca- Kardaşlar ; "Kalender"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCyeAuDEquw  (Kalender)  

after he has gone back to Germany he has continued to make progressive songs with anatolian instruments and melodies.. because he has really like this tradational sea... because anatolian tradational life is really feed with a big deep history... it s not about religion or nation or somethingelse... it s only the mind that is different than arabics or kurdishs or some other nations in middle east... everyone know that turkey is arabic.. it s really false , a dengerous false... turkish culture is really deep,friendly and honest than their culture...yes we have got some signs of arabic or grek or medeterrian or pers but really different from them ....  maybe bilek can tell this with his wonderful english .. its really hard to tell... (bilek; bi anlat yav pir sultanı,şeyh bedrettini,kazak abdalı,mevlanayı,yunus emreyi,şair kanuni sultanı ; arap zannediyolar bizi sinir oluyorum ya.. Smile
Turkish (Anatolian) Progressive Psychedelic Ethnical Rock
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2009 at 07:46
i have told about (Barış Manço' "2023", "Yeni Bir Gün"  and Erkin Koray's "Elektronik Türküler") when i have told Cem Karaca's "Yoksulluk Kader Olamaz" .. i cant forget these masterworks when i talk about  "Yoksulluk Kader olamaz" but if i have to put them in ranking, absolutely i put this album first place.. but it s not mean they are bad...they are wonderful too..maybe more than a lot of bands(or albums)  that this web page promote so we try to remove this grievance ...

Erkin Koray's "Mesafeler" is not same category with "Sevdan Beni" ... absolutely "Mesafeler" is the best pschedelic song of Turkey... but best progressive song is "Sevdan Beni" (i will upload the concert record soon to youtube so everyone can listen) .. it s my mind absolutely... but i can say it again that i can never forget "Baykoca destanı" (in 2023 - Barış Manço) "merhaba dünya- elveda ölüm" (in Yeni Bir Gün - Barış Manço) "Türkü" (Elektronik Türküler - Erkin Koray)... 











Edited by Dervisan - February 04 2009 at 15:00
Turkish (Anatolian) Progressive Psychedelic Ethnical Rock
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2009 at 08:14
we have always discussed with friends that "Tamirci Çırağı" progressive song or not... i think it s really Arabesque song (with a lot of pain)  with its lyrics but it s progressive or not, the Dervisan band is really wonderful in this song... like the others...  so you are false about that i think...

we cant separate them because all members have always helped other bands when they made new album.. for example ; Murat Töz has played  in "2023" (with Kurtalan Ekspresi) and "Yoksulluk Kader Olamaz" (with Dervisan) - he should be the government artist because of this LOL - or Fehiman Ugurdemir (feho muz LOL ) played guitar with Dadaşlar and Edirdahan... Taner Öngür has worked with Moğollar and Dervisan...........ext...ext so all members were working in a lot of master bands..

like this; you know the guitar solo in "Dönence" (barış manço) you know that this guitar solo was made by Bahadır Akkuzu ... but he didnt (or he couldnt Big smile) .. this solo was made and played by ; FEHİMAN UGURDEMİR...   

i will start to BARIŞ MANÇO biyography after Cem Karaca ... Wink


Edited by Dervisan - February 04 2009 at 08:32
Turkish (Anatolian) Progressive Psychedelic Ethnical Rock
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2009 at 09:04
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

^ could you repeat that in English please Bilek?



Let's see ... nope Tongue


well, to be honest, I thought Dervisan and I were the only ones interested in the thread, so I took the liberty to write in our native language Big smile... something which I could've done in PM anyway.

so, since it's apparent that at least one more person is involved, here's a synopsis (Dervisan gave extensive replies to what I wrote, so it will be apparent)

I first objected to the idea that  Sevdan Beni being "the greatest" Turkish prog song. I don't disagree with its awesomeness, but there are other Turkish masterpieces in the same league (mentioned in bold in original post;  Erkin Koray's Mesafeler, Türkü, Baris Mancho's 2023, 2024, and 2025 (all released as seperate tracks in subsequent albums, forming an instrumental trilogy) Gönül Dağı (also from Baris) as well as Safinaz itself, from the same artist subject of this thread. Not to mention Mogollar (Les Mogol), Edip Akbayram and Üç HürEl (3 Hürel), who made absolutely progressive music, at least from early to late seventies (let's say up to '77).I can't distinguish among any of them. All are great per se.

I also objected to "progressiveness" (not "greatness"!) of "Tamirci ciragi" mentioned above. I agree, it's a great track, emotionally, musically, and instrumentally, but absolutely not "prog" according to our definition!

In album basis, I praised Dervisan for giving credit to Erkin Koray's Elektronik Türküler and Mancho's 2023 & Yeni Bir Gün. But I do believe "the most progressive" band in Turkey happens to be Kurtalan Ekspres (Baris Mancho's backing band), at least for their '70's & early '80's stuff. This is mostly due to Mancho's genius as a multi-instrumentalist and arranger, as well as his uncanny ability to pick up young talents, who fit his musical style like a glove...

Again, I need to remind, I'm talking in technical terms here... It is totally arguable and arbitrary whether this band or that band is "the best". But in terms of defining prog, Mancho and his men made the most fitting music (although it was Cem Karaca who composed and recorded Safinaz, which is probably Turkey's sole prog-rock epic, stretching into one LP side! Baris Manco himself and strangely, another pop artist Alpay made multipart suites, but these do not exceed 12 minutes in length)

Aside from Baris's technical excellence, there are several factors which bring Cem Karaca to the fore. It's totally a matter of personal opinion to decide which one is better.

Dervisan, I appreciate your idea to write a Baris Mancho promotion Smile. You can be sure I'll give you a helping hand on that one Big smile.

Listen to Turkish psych/prog; you won't regret:
Baris Manco,Erkin Koray,Cem Karaca,Mogollar,3 Hürel,Selda,Edip Akbayram,Fikret Kizilok,Ersen (and Dadaslar) (but stick with the '70's, and 'early 80's!)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2009 at 09:23
That's a problem that we anticipated.
 
On May 20, 2007, the Symphonic Team added  all the bands in the master list were marked as Symphonic, Cem Karaca was in the Master List as Symphonic, even though it was clear for us they were not part of the sub-genre, we made the research, posted it and recommended them at least for Prog Related.
 
But as always, this work was forgotten and never followed:
 
Originally posted by Ivan_Melgar_M  on May 20, 2007 Ivan_Melgar_M  on May 20, 2007 wrote:

 

Hello, as I promised to Tony R, the Symphonic Team had an addition rally, have searched in the master list (Including Proposed and disputed artists) and this is what we got:

 

As expected we required a couple of weeks  to research, being that some of them are prehistoric and/or totally obscure, so info wasn’t be easily available and samples much less

 
(...)
 
  1. Cem Karaca: Another hard task, the guy is from Turkey, except for Allmusic (Not reliable at all) all the info is in Turkish and his lyrics are mostly in Ancient Anatolian. Cem Karaca was a prolific and polemic musician/Marxist politician who had an amazing live, even accused of treason because of his ideas and later received a pardon. For the samples I could find everywhere and the information available, he played some sort of Pop/Proggish ethnic music, not adequate for Symphonic at all, even made some Rap…In Anatolian!!!!…The Orchestral tracks are the less Prog (A paradox) sound like French Chanson in some weird language  but very mainstream

I don’t dare to recommend him to Prog Folk, too mainstream IMHO, should be checked for Prog Related……According to Bob could be Avant Rio mostly for the lyrics BUT NO WAY SYMPHONIC…..Please provide us some info when receiving this obscure and rare artists, some samples can be found at: http://www.tulumba.com/storeItem.asp?ic=MU939609CV849 or in his Allmusic entry.

 
 
Guys, please, don't look at this thread and omit it, we have done a research that must be used, we are recommending some bands to some sub-genres and this is already verified, lets use what we found.
 
Tony R: We kept our word with you.

 

Bob, HT, James, Iván
 
 
 
But as we guessed it was omited, nobody checked the list and most of the 12 bands already researched by us and posted in the list (Except the couple of Symphonic ones) hasn't been added.
 
Iván


Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - February 04 2009 at 09:30
            
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