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Marlon 
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 30 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 201
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 Topic: The Count Of Tuscany
Posted: July 20 2009 at 06:25 |
 birdwithteeth11 wrote:
There's not much to justify, Mike. The majority of what you say is mostly based on your opinion of the song. I on the other hand think The Count of Tuscany is the best song on the album and don't care too much about cheesy lyrics unless the music isn't that good (but I think it is). But really we could go in circles about this and never get anywhere.
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I do agree with you and TCoT is the best song of the album. I really don't care about the lyrics as english is not my first language. Also, when I want to, I can turn off the translation on my brain and listen to the voice only as an instrument 
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Conor Fynes
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 11 2009
Location: Vancouver, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 3196
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Posted: July 20 2009 at 05:00 |
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topofsm
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 17 2008
Location: Arizona, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 1698
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Posted: July 20 2009 at 02:39 |
MovingPictures07 wrote:
LiquidEternity wrote:
It's Dream Theater on the whole toned down a bit, with none of those four minute noodly guitar solos. It flows and segues like a twenty minute song should. Musically, it's some of their most creative output for a long time. The lyrics might bother you, but only if you're an old grump. It's just a nice long song. Not their greatest, but above average. Slightly behind The Best of Times as the peak of the whole album, at least in my opinion. It's not AWESOME, but hey, it's a pretty good one! And it's an epic-length track that doesn't obsess itself over the idea of sounding really EPIC like Supper's Ready or some Spock's Beard suite. Aside from how long it is, I find it a very unassuming, very underdemanding Dream Theater song, something they could use more of.
That any better? We can't make you like it, but perhaps you can come to respect it.
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Summed up my thoughts right here.
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IMO less noodling doesn't make up for poor compositional skills, weak lyrics, and lack of interesting ideas.
I finally made a crappy new sig based on the song though like I said though. I think it's kind of funny personally.
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Proggy Pogo
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 16 2009
Location: Manchester, UK
Status: Offline
Points: 198
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Posted: July 19 2009 at 13:10 |
King By-Tor wrote:
I'm someone who normally enjoys a good amount of cheese...
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Personally I don't think you can get better than a good mature cheddar. Italian Pecorino is good too, though.
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Queen By-Tor
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: September 13 2006
Location: Xanadu
Status: Offline
Points: 16111
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Posted: July 17 2009 at 11:50 |
yes but you completely missed all my points 
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MovingPictures07
Prog Reviewer
Joined: January 09 2008
Location: Beasty Heart
Status: Offline
Points: 32181
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Posted: July 17 2009 at 11:43 |
LiquidEternity wrote:
It's Dream Theater on the whole toned down a bit, with none of those four minute noodly guitar solos. It flows and segues like a twenty minute song should. Musically, it's some of their most creative output for a long time. The lyrics might bother you, but only if you're an old grump. It's just a nice long song. Not their greatest, but above average. Slightly behind The Best of Times as the peak of the whole album, at least in my opinion. It's not AWESOME, but hey, it's a pretty good one! And it's an epic-length track that doesn't obsess itself over the idea of sounding really EPIC like Supper's Ready or some Spock's Beard suite. Aside from how long it is, I find it a very unassuming, very underdemanding Dream Theater song, something they could use more of.
That any better? We can't make you like it, but perhaps you can come to respect it.
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Summed up my thoughts right here.
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Queen By-Tor
Special Collaborator
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Joined: September 13 2006
Location: Xanadu
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Posted: July 17 2009 at 11:34 |
progrules wrote:
King By-Tor wrote:
progrules wrote:
Not to stab a knife in your back Mike but have you seen this ?
Probably more people who don't mind lyrics ?  I thought about it some more today and I have to conclude you're right in the end. I mean especially on this album (but also in the past) DT seems to write lyrics for 12 year old kids or something. I don't think I'm too happy that you opened my eyes with this. I always thought DT was (near) perfect but the lyrics are indeed a big minus. |
that was the point! I don't get why so many people like it!
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Came to think of this: DT's lyrics on Awake (1994, remember ?) were brilliant, absolutely stunning.
And then you start to think: where (or when) did they go astray ? They must have run out of fuel completely last couple of years where the lyrics are concerned for they haven't always been poor, right ? |
SC was getting cheesy, and on this one they just completely went overboard...
anyways, here's what I had to say in my review of the album about the song:
| Then we get to The Count Of Tuscany. It is beyond me how so many people can be head over heels in love with this song and dislike the majority of Systematic Chaos. This is everything that album was, only more poorly written, cheesier, and with a terrible ending to the tale. Granted, this song was based on a true story and the music is relatively decent (although not enough so to support 20-minutes of music, and yes, I did hear that Rushinterlude in the middle. boys... buying yourself time, eh?), but the lyrics are absolutely grotesque, and I don't say that in a good way. I respect Petrucci for this writing and playing skills, but to have lines like ''Like The finest wines/improve with age'' or ''sitting in his chair/sucking on his pipe'' in a song that's supposed to make you feel scared like the main character... come on! The lyrics are just plain laughable and make the more troubadouric side of progressive rock look like a 10th grade English assignment. The only thing that saves this song is some of the impressive playing at the beginning and end, and even then you might miss it from laughing at the lyrics so hard. |
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rdtprog
Special Collaborator
Heavy, RPI, Symph, JR/F Canterbury Teams
Joined: April 04 2009
Location: Mtl, QC
Status: Offline
Points: 5145
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Posted: July 17 2009 at 08:33 |
StyLaZyn wrote:
Listening to TCoT again right now. The only good part is the middle solo by Petrucci. The lyrics totally kill this song otherwise. I suppose the youths will enjoy it though. |
And some dinosaur too!
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Music is the refuge of souls ulcerated by happiness.
Emile M. Cioran
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StyLaZyn
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 22 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 4079
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Posted: July 17 2009 at 08:10 |
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Listening to TCoT again right now. The only good part is the middle solo by Petrucci. The lyrics totally kill this song otherwise. I suppose the youths will enjoy it though.
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progrules
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 14 2007
Location: Netherlands
Status: Offline
Points: 958
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Posted: July 17 2009 at 02:50 |
King By-Tor wrote:
progrules wrote:
Not to stab a knife in your back Mike but have you seen this ?
Probably more people who don't mind lyrics ? I thought about it some more today and I have to conclude you're right in the end. I mean especially on this album (but also in the past) DT seems to write lyrics for 12 year old kids or something. I don't think I'm too happy that you opened my eyes with this. I always thought DT was (near) perfect but the lyrics are indeed a big minus. |
that was the point! I don't get why so many people like it!
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Came to think of this: DT's lyrics on Awake (1994, remember ?) were brilliant, absolutely stunning.
And then you start to think: where (or when) did they go astray ? They must have run out of fuel completely last couple of years where the lyrics are concerned for they haven't always been poor, right ?
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A day without prog is a wasted day
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Leningrad
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 15 2006
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 7991
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Posted: July 14 2009 at 16:03 |
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These lyrics are probably the worst thing I've ever read. And I've read Atlas Shrugged.
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rdtprog
Special Collaborator
Heavy, RPI, Symph, JR/F Canterbury Teams
Joined: April 04 2009
Location: Mtl, QC
Status: Offline
Points: 5145
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Posted: July 14 2009 at 15:25 |
I really enjoyed this song including the passage when they slow down the tempo in a quiet and emotional way that reminded me of the beginning of Octavarium song. 
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Music is the refuge of souls ulcerated by happiness.
Emile M. Cioran
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Conor Fynes
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 11 2009
Location: Vancouver, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 3196
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Posted: July 14 2009 at 15:12 |
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first four minutes and last four minutes are GOLD though, regardless
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Queen By-Tor
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: September 13 2006
Location: Xanadu
Status: Offline
Points: 16111
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Posted: July 13 2009 at 21:21 |
progrules wrote:
Not to stab a knife in your back Mike but have you seen this ?
Probably more people who don't mind lyrics ? I thought about it some more today and I have to conclude you're right in the end. I mean especially on this album (but also in the past) DT seems to write lyrics for 12 year old kids or something. I don't think I'm too happy that you opened my eyes with this. I always thought DT was (near) perfect but the lyrics are indeed a big minus. |
that was the point! I don't get why so many people like it!
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J-Man
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 07 2008
Location: Philadelphia,PA
Status: Offline
Points: 7826
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Posted: July 13 2009 at 20:46 |
King By-Tor wrote:
no, not happy with the song, but thanks for your explaination.
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No problem
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J-Man
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 07 2008
Location: Philadelphia,PA
Status: Offline
Points: 7826
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Posted: July 13 2009 at 20:45 |
progrules wrote:
Not to stab a knife in your back Mike but have you seen this ?
Probably more people who don't mind lyrics ? I thought about it some more today and I have to conclude you're right in the end. I mean especially on this album (but also in the past) DT seems to write lyrics for 12 year old kids or something. I don't think I'm too happy that you opened my eyes with this. I always thought DT was (near) perfect but the lyrics are indeed a big minus. |
Well on The Count I agree that the lyrics are a big minus, but on Scenes From A Memory the lyrics are an even bigger plus 
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topofsm
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 17 2008
Location: Arizona, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 1698
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Posted: July 13 2009 at 17:53 |
IMO "The Count of Tuscany" has to be one of the worse things DT has pulled out of the bag. I may have been dissapointed because of the lack of heavier moments in the song but it really doesn't do to much for me. There really wasn't anything for me. It's The less inspired and somewhat heavy moments of SFAM that suddenly turns into Trail of Tears towards the end.
As for the lyrics, I literally burst out laughing when Portnoy shouted out "SUCKING ON HIS PIPE!". I'm probably going to make a sig for that.
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progrules
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 14 2007
Location: Netherlands
Status: Offline
Points: 958
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Posted: July 13 2009 at 13:20 |
Not to stab a knife in your back Mike but have you seen this ?
Probably more people who don't mind lyrics ? I thought about it some more today and I have to conclude you're right in the end. I mean especially on this album (but also in the past) DT seems to write lyrics for 12 year old kids or something. I don't think I'm too happy that you opened my eyes with this. I always thought DT was (near) perfect but the lyrics are indeed a big minus.
Edited by progrules - July 13 2009 at 13:21
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A day without prog is a wasted day
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Conor Fynes
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 11 2009
Location: Vancouver, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 3196
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Posted: July 12 2009 at 15:07 |
'The Count of Tuscany' is the reason Mike Portnoy included an Instrumental disc in the Special Edition
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progrules
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 14 2007
Location: Netherlands
Status: Offline
Points: 958
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Posted: July 12 2009 at 11:01 |
Good thread so far. I just procured the album yesterday and only heard "A Nightmare" a couple of times on Morow before that. So I heard The Count of Tuscany three times so far and to be honest I think it's a very good epic, even for DT standard. But then I don't include the lyrical aspect. I hardly dig in lyrics I have to admit. But I know what you mean Mike. Although mr Progfreak did put it into an interesting perspective, didn't he ?
But if it wouldn't have been a personal experience of Petrucci it would indeed be very cheesy.
The instrumental parts of the composition isn't much wrong with in my opinion nor with the build up.
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A day without prog is a wasted day
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The Count Of Tuscany
