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Catcher10 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Vinyl
    Posted: July 23 2014 at 22:45
Thanks......I do plan to purchase it. My list is getting too long, ughhh!
But its vinyl!!!
      
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Post Options Post Options   Quote progbethyname Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 23 2014 at 21:45
Originally posted by Catcher10

Nice review Nick! I don't have the ability to play/hear 5.1/DTS so on as my BRP is upstairs and 100% used for watching BR movies.

I am interested in the vinyl issue of A Passion Play, since pretty much all SW has remixed is amazing!

In the box set it does specify that SW remixed from the original analog tapes?


Thanks Catch!!

I feel fortunate to have been able to get a better understanding of the main differences. I owe everything to my new rig for that. :)
The Tull boxset is literally an audiophile wet dream. You can't ask for more, and to answer your question the 16 track analog tapes were procured with ease and Wilson even included the original 1973 mix in all its authentication. Tape hiss included, but the to tonality of the instruments is so warm and real it blows my mind. It's my favourite mix, especially since it was done in a FLAT EQ transfer. Wilson is a pretty good engineer. I've got a huge amount of respect for him and I love how he is restoring all these classic albums with the good intention of staying true to the original pressing.
He is definitely along with Alan Parsons, as one of the best in the business.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 23 2014 at 16:04
Nice review Nick! I don't have the ability to play/hear 5.1/DTS so on as my BRP is upstairs and 100% used for watching BR movies.

I am interested in the vinyl issue of A Passion Play, since pretty much all SW has remixed is amazing!

In the box set it does specify that SW remixed from the original analog tapes?
      
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Post Options Post Options   Quote progbethyname Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2014 at 19:38
Hello vinyl/analog junkies.

I know I really don't have to post or justify my findings with all of you cause YOU ALL pretty much know how superior Analog is to digital for most music listening experiences, but I do want to share some findings that some might find interesting. ;)
I bought the new Jethro Tull Passion Play cd/DVD boxset with the new Steven Wilson sound mixes included. In total there are 5 different sound mixes/bit depths to choose from.
1) 24/96k DTS surround
2) Dolby Digital AC3 surround
3) 24/96 LPCM
4) Original Album mix (transferred flat 24/96 LPCM
5) standard red book 16/44k

Ok. So here is my point. I did some intense A and B'ing. I played all of these audio formats through my HIFI headphones and of course ran all of these audio formats through my DAC. My DAC can accept all of these audio conversions because my blu-ray player has the option to take the PCM Downmix and add digital surround sound conversion, so my DAC can read the signal accurately. Anyway. My findings are simple. Analog is far superior to digital surround even through headphones.
Here are the differences or my findings. (Pros/cons)

Analog.
1) vocals are pushed forward with a more accurate tone and clarity in the overall soundstage.
2) Instruments sound real!!! Drums, flutes, saxaphones etc all have a far richer tonality.
3) The Bass!!! More punchy, vibrant and clear sounding. You can really feel the warm vibration from the instrument itself.
Cons--None

Digital surround. (DTS/Dolby Digital)

Pros.

Major sound separation. The soundstage is channeled off to give the listener a very immersive experience. You get hit with sound from every possible direction with a high degree of accuracy. However, unfortunately this is the only pro that reigns over Analog.
CONS.
Soundstage may sound ultra clear, but it sounds ultra fake!! Quite simply the instruments don't sound real at all. Their tones are compressed mainly cause the resolution or bit depth is running at a much higher rate.
2) Vocals. The sibilance is so out of wack. It sounds harsh and very piercing. Upon listening to say 'overseer overture' my ears were in pain when Anderson sings his vocal parts.
3) The Treble. Where's the warmth? It's so robotic sounding and once again very piercing.

So these are my findings. I should note I used all high end audio equipment to run this test. Analog reigns supreme to my ears. It's accurate, warm and inviting to what the original recoding or pressing has to offer, so to all of you vinyl appreciators out there I say KEEP YOUR RECORDS! But again, most of you already know this but I thought I would share my findings because there really is a night and day difference. I'm just thankful that I'm listening to music the way it was intended from the artists vision/sound reproduction.

I Also wanna say I did one more A/B test. Now I'm mentioning this because I know vinyl records are quite expensive nowadays, but there is an alternative to make your CDs sound like a vinyl record. Investing in a high end DAC and amplifier for your headphones or speakers will make your CDs sound like 180g vinyl pressing. It is very accurate if you get the right gear of course. Long story short. I couldn't hear a difference. A slight bit of crackling hear and there from the record, but that's probably because his player isn't crazy high end like yours CATCHER 10. :)

Anyway. It was a lot of fun conducting these tests and after careful listening I can honestly say I'm pro ANALOG.
Digital technologies still have their place, especially for movie watching and some music concert DVDs, but as far as straight listening goes Analog really kicks the pants out of digital.

Happy listening.
I
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Post Options Post Options   Quote progbethyname Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2014 at 19:38
Originally posted by Catcher10

Originally posted by progbethyname

Also Catcher!!

Congrats on the new cartridge. I am sure that turntable of yours is singing pretty clear now.
The worst is hearing any kind of 'popping' or small crackling sounds when trying to concentrate on an album your listening to. ;)

So what's the make and model on that sucker? :)


My older vinyl has some surface noise but that is perfectly fine...old things creek and crack on occasion
But I am meticulous on cleaning my vinyl and needle, I have 30yr old vinyl that has no surface noise. Once the music starts you don't hear any tics or pops..In between songs who cares....

Cartridge is an Audio Technica ATOC9ML/II moving coil cartridge. The ML stands for Micro-Line, that shape mimics the shape of the cutter head used to create the master stamper, so it digs deep and pulls out much more detail. Shibata and Line Contact are other terms to describe that cut of diamond.


And that is how you groove those lines to perfection and that what separates the men from the boys in quality music listening. Well done.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote progbethyname Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 22 2014 at 18:41
Originally posted by Catcher10

Yes it looks different because there is no "lip" on the outer edge due to the outside locked groove, so it is a flat record. Also one side is a flat black matte finish to give it that old 78rpm looking finish.

One thing I have not done is play the tracks that lie in the label...My tone arm will not go that far, and you are playing the tracks thru the paper label, not too keen on doing that with my cartridge...what I understand its just some noise anyway...

I think it is a cool album to have in a collection.


I remember you describing the characteristics and unique attributes of that record. I found that incredibly fascinating.
Pretty amazing stuff. Just too bad the music isn't Marillion quality.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2014 at 12:26
Originally posted by akamaisondufromage


Cleaning Vinyl with Wood Glue!LOLdigg.com/video/want-to-hear-a-satisfying-noise-clean-your-vinyls-with-wood-glue?utm_source=digg&utm_medium=email



It can work, I tried it on a very dirty $1 purchase yard sale find. It takes too long and I don't have the patience. But it did pull out all the gunk and grime in the grooves. The "glue disc" had all the gunk stuck to it..
What I actually prefer on super dirty yard sale finds is using Scrubbing Bubbles and a soft paint pad, scrub away and rinse it well. Leaves the LP squeaky clean......
      
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Post Options Post Options   Quote akamaisondufromage Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2014 at 08:40

Cleaning Vinyl with Wood Glue!

LOL

digg.com/video/want-to-hear-a-satisfying-noise-clean-your-vinyls-with-wood-glue?utm_source=digg&utm_medium=email




Edited by akamaisondufromage - July 20 2014 at 08:41
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 19 2014 at 16:42
Originally posted by Hawkwise


Originally posted by Catcher10



Its amazing how fantastic some of these old recordings are, just sitting and hearing what is going on, its crazy good. These engineers back in the day really studied their craft and perfected mic placement in recording studios. Versus now adays "just put a whole bunch of mics in the room since we have endless tracks with digital recording..."

Oh well, maybe some can make it work but nothing sounds as good as some of these old recordings. The emotion of Louis's face is so present on this recording, I can see it in the grooves

Vinyl on my analog friends!

SNAP !!


Great analog minds think alike!!

      
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 19 2014 at 16:40
Originally posted by Hawkwise



Originally posted by Catcher10

Another news pc on vinyl and the gaining popularity of it...

http://www.cbsnews.com/videos/vinyls-resurrection-sales-at-a-record-high/

Much as its nice to see vinyl on the Up again, the Down side is the Prices are going up through the roof 
45 Bucks for the new Division Bell , that comes with no sleeve notes or lyric sheet .
I call that a Rip Off. which is a shame as i wouldn't mind it just to complete my Floyd Vinyl ( I have all the other Floyd on Vinyl )  but ent paying 45 freaking bucks ...
Blue Note the Jazz label are amble to re issue all there old classics for just under 20 bucks a shot and are top class
pressings so if they can do it then ????
But Hey Money its gas grab that cash with both hands etc etc



I agree...demand and supply, business 101..If they demand it then charge more! Look at all analog gear prices, have gone up at least 25% over the past 5yrs. You could buy Nagaoka cartridges cheap, the top end MP-500 used to be about US$450, now it runs close to $600.

There are some good buys out there, gotta look though and as you know you get what you pay for. Especially these new issues on vinyl, so many people are demanding more mastering from analog tape, and if they do it does cost more, but really not much, sounds glorious when done right though.
      
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Hawkwise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 19 2014 at 14:02
Originally posted by Catcher10



Its amazing how fantastic some of these old recordings are, just sitting and hearing what is going on, its crazy good. These engineers back in the day really studied their craft and perfected mic placement in recording studios. Versus now adays "just put a whole bunch of mics in the room since we have endless tracks with digital recording..."

Oh well, maybe some can make it work but nothing sounds as good as some of these old recordings. The emotion of Louis's face is so present on this recording, I can see it in the grooves

Vinyl on my analog friends!


SNAP !!


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Post Options Post Options   Quote Hawkwise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 19 2014 at 13:54
Originally posted by Catcher10

Another news pc on vinyl and the gaining popularity of it...

http://www.cbsnews.com/videos/vinyls-resurrection-sales-at-a-record-high/


Much as its nice to see vinyl on the Up again, the Down side is the Prices are going up through the roof 

45 Bucks for the new Division Bell , that comes with no sleeve notes or lyric sheet .

I call that a Rip Off. which is a shame as i wouldn't mind it just to complete my Floyd Vinyl ( I have all the other Floyd on Vinyl )  but ent paying 45 freaking bucks ...


Blue Note the Jazz label are amble to re issue all there old classics for just under 20 bucks a shot and are top class
pressings so if they can do it then ????

But Hey Money its gas grab that cash with both hands etc etc


Edited by Hawkwise - July 19 2014 at 13:57
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 19 2014 at 13:50
^ Your killing me Hawk!!! I need to find more Nektar....
      
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Hawkwise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 19 2014 at 13:48
Originally posted by Catcher10

Another vinyl gem to discuss....This one always amazes me at how good it sounds even today. The clarity and placement of instruments within the soundstage is excellent.
The rhythm guitar on side I is fantastic and the cymbal ride tapping is super sweet, the vocals are so nice too.

Of course another RL in the deadwax...the guy is a genius at his craft.



Nektar !!!


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Post Options Post Options   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 18 2014 at 15:45
Yes it looks different because there is no "lip" on the outer edge due to the outside locked groove, so it is a flat record. Also one side is a flat black matte finish to give it that old 78rpm looking finish.

One thing I have not done is play the tracks that lie in the label...My tone arm will not go that far, and you are playing the tracks thru the paper label, not too keen on doing that with my cartridge...what I understand its just some noise anyway...

I think it is a cool album to have in a collection.
      
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Post Options Post Options   Quote HolyMoly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 18 2014 at 14:23
Originally posted by Catcher10

Originally posted by HolyMoly

OK, this is kind of weird, but here goes.
For my birthday, my wife's sister and her husband sent me an LP in the mail.  It wasn't on my wish list, and I don't even know if they are fans of the artist or not (neither of them are really music fans at all, to be honest), it was a total surprise.  The LP in question was "Lazaretto", the new album by Jack White (formerly of White Stripes).   I have no real knowledge of his music in any of his various bands, but I was aware of who he is and I may have heard a White Stripes song or two in the past.  So I never dreamed I'd ever get this album, least of all on vinyl.
Now the weirder part.  Tonight, I put it on, and all I heard was a weird looping noise in a locked groove at the beginning of side 1.  So I figured ok, a defective record.  I'll just skip past that part and pretend that wasn't there.  So I did, and about a minute later it happened again.   So I dropped the needle much farther into the side and watched.  And lo and behold, the record was running backwards!  I mean, it was spinning the right way, but the grooves were running out from the center to the edge rather than vice versa as it has been on every other record I've seen.  I admit to being a little creeped out by this.  Thousands of records over 40+ years and I... I... I need to sit down.
Doesn't seem natural, and I'm not sure it sounded that great.  What's up with that?


Lazaretto is a special album that Jack did with many, many hidden tid bits. Side 1 plays from inside out, you start the needle at the very inside groove. The locked groove, which is a common thing, is actually on the outside edge to prevent the needle from falling off the edge.
Side 2 has a double groove for the first song, one is an acoustic start, the other groove is a full set...both grooves then lead into one groove to finish out the song...very cool.

Also did you notice the hologram as the record spins of the angels? A page or two back here I posted a link to his video introducing the album features. Here is my post.....

Enjoy the album, I am not a listener of his music, I do like Side 2 best though

Originally posted by Catcher10

So yesterday I received my copy of Jack White's Lazaretto (Ultra LP). If you did not read up on it, this album has a lot of vinyl "gimmicks" included. I am not a JW listener but I wanted this album for its gimmicky stuff.

Here is a YT of the stuff on the vinyl....also this album was recorded to tape and all analog mastering. I will say the sound quality is very good, nice and warm with ZERO compression! Wish other artists would do this.

Anyhow its a cool album, good sound.

Thanks for clearing that up.  Wasn't aware of the double groove on side two, but I have noticed that the record just flat out looks different.  The sleeve talks about the hologram, but maybe my lighting wasn't too good because I couldn't see it.

I think I may have read your old post when you talked about it before, but it had slipped my mind.  When I wrote my post last night, I had a vague memory of something.   Story of my life after 40... vague memories of things all day long.

So it seems like a cool album to have after all.  I wonder if my sister in law was aware of all this when she got it for me.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 18 2014 at 14:10
Originally posted by uduwudu


Originally posted by HolyMoly

OK, this is kind of weird, but here goes.
For my birthday, my wife's sister and her husband sent me an LP in the mail.  It wasn't on my wish list, and I don't even know if they are fans of the artist or not (neither of them are really music fans at all, to be honest), it was a total surprise.  The LP in question was "Lazaretto", the new album by Jack White (formerly of White Stripes).   I have no real knowledge of his music in any of his various bands, but I was aware of who he is and I may have heard a White Stripes song or two in the past.  So I never dreamed I'd ever get this album, least of all on vinyl.
Now the weirder part.  Tonight, I put it on, and all I heard was a weird looping noise in a locked groove at the beginning of side 1.  So I figured ok, a defective record.  I'll just skip past that part and pretend that wasn't there.  So I did, and about a minute later it happened again.   So I dropped the needle much farther into the side and watched.  And lo and behold, the record was running backwards!  I mean, it was spinning the right way, but the grooves were running out from the center to the edge rather than vice versa as it has been on every other record I've seen.  I admit to being a little creeped out by this.  Thousands of records over 40+ years and I... I... I need to sit down.
Doesn't seem natural, and I'm not sure it sounded that great.  What's up with that?
This is the best (sort of) thing I have read about a record since hearing about one that was half ITCOTCK and half Status Quo (or one labelled Bruce Springsteen when it was supposed to be Aerosmith. Satanic Messages (backward masking) notwithstanding - the fun you could have with these and this record on the gullible and suggestible. Do not get rid of this record! Wonder what the digital medium sounds like...An interesting pressing fault. Tweet White and see what he says.


Its not a pressing fault......everything on the album was done on purpose.
This release charted the highest vinyl release of the year a couple weeks ago..I think it was something like 50,000 units on vinyl...I think

Pretty cool!
      
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 18 2014 at 12:01
Originally posted by HolyMoly

OK, this is kind of weird, but here goes.
For my birthday, my wife's sister and her husband sent me an LP in the mail.  It wasn't on my wish list, and I don't even know if they are fans of the artist or not (neither of them are really music fans at all, to be honest), it was a total surprise.  The LP in question was "Lazaretto", the new album by Jack White (formerly of White Stripes).   I have no real knowledge of his music in any of his various bands, but I was aware of who he is and I may have heard a White Stripes song or two in the past.  So I never dreamed I'd ever get this album, least of all on vinyl.
Now the weirder part.  Tonight, I put it on, and all I heard was a weird looping noise in a locked groove at the beginning of side 1.  So I figured ok, a defective record.  I'll just skip past that part and pretend that wasn't there.  So I did, and about a minute later it happened again.   So I dropped the needle much farther into the side and watched.  And lo and behold, the record was running backwards!  I mean, it was spinning the right way, but the grooves were running out from the center to the edge rather than vice versa as it has been on every other record I've seen.  I admit to being a little creeped out by this.  Thousands of records over 40+ years and I... I... I need to sit down.
Doesn't seem natural, and I'm not sure it sounded that great.  What's up with that?


Lazaretto is a special album that Jack did with many, many hidden tid bits. Side 1 plays from inside out, you start the needle at the very inside groove. The locked groove, which is a common thing, is actually on the outside edge to prevent the needle from falling off the edge.
Side 2 has a double groove for the first song, one is an acoustic start, the other groove is a full set...both grooves then lead into one groove to finish out the song...very cool.

Also did you notice the hologram as the record spins of the angels? A page or two back here I posted a link to his video introducing the album features. Here is my post.....

Enjoy the album, I am not a listener of his music, I do like Side 2 best though

Originally posted by Catcher10

So yesterday I received my copy of Jack White's Lazaretto (Ultra LP). If you did not read up on it, this album has a lot of vinyl "gimmicks" included. I am not a JW listener but I wanted this album for its gimmicky stuff.

Here is a YT of the stuff on the vinyl....also this album was recorded to tape and all analog mastering. I will say the sound quality is very good, nice and warm with ZERO compression! Wish other artists would do this.

Anyhow its a cool album, good sound.

      
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Post Options Post Options   Quote uduwudu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 17 2014 at 22:19
Originally posted by HolyMoly

OK, this is kind of weird, but here goes.

For my birthday, my wife's sister and her husband sent me an LP in the mail.  It wasn't on my wish list, and I don't even know if they are fans of the artist or not (neither of them are really music fans at all, to be honest), it was a total surprise.  The LP in question was "Lazaretto", the new album by Jack White (formerly of White Stripes).   I have no real knowledge of his music in any of his various bands, but I was aware of who he is and I may have heard a White Stripes song or two in the past.  So I never dreamed I'd ever get this album, least of all on vinyl.

Now the weirder part.  Tonight, I put it on, and all I heard was a weird looping noise in a locked groove at the beginning of side 1.  So I figured ok, a defective record.  I'll just skip past that part and pretend that wasn't there.  So I did, and about a minute later it happened again.   So I dropped the needle much farther into the side and watched.  And lo and behold, the record was running backwards!  I mean, it was spinning the right way, but the grooves were running out from the center to the edge rather than vice versa as it has been on every other record I've seen.  I admit to being a little creeped out by this.  Thousands of records over 40+ years and I... I... I need to sit down.

Doesn't seem natural, and I'm not sure it sounded that great.  What's up with that?


This is the best (sort of) thing I have read about a record since hearing about one that was half ITCOTCK and half Status Quo (or one labelled Bruce Springsteen when it was supposed to be Aerosmith. Satanic Messages (backward masking) notwithstanding - the fun you could have with these and this record on the gullible and suggestible.

Do not get rid of this record! Wonder what the digital medium sounds like...

An interesting pressing fault. Tweet White and see what he says.


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Post Options Post Options   Quote progbethyname Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 17 2014 at 21:51
Still living the analog dream. I am THE ANALOG KID.

:)
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