XTC, Rod Argent, Garfield

Dean wrote: Svetonio wrote: Dean wrote: There is little doubt that some of the more talented musicians who came to prominence in the 80s would have formed Prog bands if they had been around in the 70s - that's not quite the same as claiming that those musicians were Prog musicians in hiding. Partridge, Moulding, Chambers and Andrews were in a band from 1973 - they were never Prog during that time though may have listened to it (Colin Moulding has said he listened to Tull in the 70s) - and of course Glam Rock and Psychedelic Pop figured as a strong influences on them. I don't care about Partridge, Moulding, Chambers and Andrews. Let's imagine that there was nothing recorded by King Crimson before Discipline the album; at the time of the appearance of the album in stores, KC would be valid for New Wave flawless. Well, duh!

Yes, it is obvious matter of fashion.

Dean wrote: There is little doubt that some of the more talented musicians who came to prominence in the 80s would have formed Prog bands if they had been around in the 70s - that's not quite the same as claiming that those musicians were Prog musicians in hiding. Partridge, Moulding, Chambers and Andrews were in a band from 1973 - they were never Prog during that time though may have listened to it (Colin Moulding has said he listened to Tull in the 70s) - and of course Glam Rock and Psychedelic Pop figured as a strong influences on them.

I don't care about Partridge, Moulding, Chambers and Andrews. Let's imagine that there was nothing recorded by King Crimson before Discipline the album; at the time of the appearance of the album in stores, KC would be valid for New Wave flawless.

Edited by Svetonio - April 26 2013 at 05:21

Dean wrote: Two pages in and no one's attempted the Dukes' manoeuvrer. That's a first.

I understand it's banned in 90% of countries.

^Punk? Maybe. Punks like their first Science Friction EP and it certainly has that homemade garage band vibe. Fits right into the Punk ethos. The debut album expanded on that. Less punky for sure but still  a series of short sharp (clever) songs. They kind of grew from there. Flowered. So more New wave than actual Punk. But never prog.

chopper wrote: stegor wrote: Funny - XTC was the first non-prog band I looked for when I was trying to find the edge of the Prog boundaries as drawn by ProgArchives. They weren't here, but it was evident that it wasn't because they weren't considered, based on the depth and width and breadth of the map. But it didn't surprise me. XTC showed up with punk, and were instrumental in dismantling Prog right along with the Sex Pistols. I noticed that PIL, Magazine and Shriekback are missing also, which suggests to me that it's not just the style of music that designates Prog, it's also the effect that the artist had on Prog culture. Never mind that XTC was influenced by BeBop Deluxe, The Residents and Beefheart, they were here to slay the dinosaurs. So from that angle I can see why they could be considered Anti-Prog. But by killing prog they rescued it. It couldn't go on like it was. Not with Love Beach. Prog had jumped the shark. XTC was like a stealth bomber. Or maybe a Trojan horse. They looked like punk, sounded like punk, smelled like punk, and kicked Greg Lake's arse. But if you were paying attention, you might have noticed that songs like X-Wires, from their debut album, sounded more like Beefheart than The Sex Pistols. And then, when we least expected it, after they wiped out Tull, ELP, Yes and Genesis, they served up a full-on capital P Progressive Rock double album: English Settlement. Clever little pricks. So personally, I can see how they shouldn't be included, and at the same time see how they should be considered the most important Prog band of the '80's. I don't know what I would have done without them. XTC killed prog? I thought the Clash had already done that. (...)

I disagree. On contrary, Clash's London Calling the album was "destroyed" Punk, not Prog. Mr Stevens, as a great producer with weird ideas, then was changed the guidelines of the genre;  London Calling  was Sgt. Pepper of Punk.

I thought you could only use 'Dukes Manoeuvre' after landing on 'Swiss Cottage'?

Well, if English Settlement is XTC's proggiest album but still isn't Prog then XTC isn't Prog! Pretty simple.

Snow Dog wrote: chopper wrote:   And is English Settlement really a prog album? NO

That's what I thought. It's one of the best double albums ever made, end to end brilliance, but it's not prog.

chopper wrote:   And is English Settlement really a prog album?

Wow - that was interesting to look back at. Visage! Fond, poofy memories. I know we're going way off topic now, but All those bands that went down the Bowie/Kraftwerk/Roxy path like Magazine, Ultravox and Gary Numan - I absolutely love them as much as any Prog. But I started listening to them around 1980 precisely because they were NOT Prog. Add to that Polyrock, and some real obscurities like The Units, Experiments With Ice and Ceramic Hello. Then there's OMD. I don't care how hard you try, despite the fact that OMD did some incredibly unique and experimental music they will never be Prog (I just checked to make sure I wouldn't have to eat my words).

Of course OMD is not XTC, so let's get back on topic.
All this bickering has distracted everyone from my erudite dissertation on XTC. Now go back there and read it for cryin out loud!