Why listen to mediocre prog if you not a collector

HarbouringTheSoul wrote: Dayvenkirq wrote: ^ But impact is only a part of the story, no? Sure. But I reject all other parts of the 'story' as well. Nothing but enjoyment for me. Dayvenkirq wrote: HarbouringTheSoul wrote: Dayvenkirq wrote: 2) You have to remember that a masterpiece is essential to prog rock music. Says who? The description for five stars reads "Essential: a masterpiece of progressive rock music, but that doesn't mean that the album is essential to the genre, it means that the album is essential to the hypothetical listener, i.e. "everyone should hear this". Any prog album I enjoy so immensely that I give it five stars is to my ears essential. Says who? It does not specify what is essential. Ergo, it is open to interpretation. Now, I'm pretty sure that lots of people would disagree with you on this one, ... But then lots of other people would agree. And when you said that a masterpiece is defined by more things than just enjoyment, that was also open for debate. Let's just agree to disagree. HarbouringTheSoul wrote: Dayvenkirq wrote: 2) You have to remember that a masterpiece is essential to prog rock music. Says who? The description for five stars reads "Essential: a masterpiece of progressive rock music", but that doesn't mean that the album is essential to the genre, it means that the album is essential to the hypothetical listener, i.e. "everyone should hear this". Any prog album I enjoy so immensely that I give it five stars is to my ears essential. Two different ideas of "essential".

No, what I mean is that every album that I enjoy enough to give it five stars is also one I would recommend to everybody (maybe not "everyone should hear this" because I don't want to tell other people what to listen to).[/QUOTE]

I tell ya something fellas, FOXTROT is definitely a well deserved FIVER!!! *****

Neelus wrote: Haven't you heard? Masochism is the new popular thing!

OUCH! !!

Why listen to mediocre prog if you not a collector.'

think this question is needs a ? At the end. Anyway, of course why would you, but what's mediocre to one person is a masterpiece to another. I think we are delving into subjectivity here again .

Again. We are forcing ourselves to quantify music, which is very hard to do on a universal level. We only have our opinions and and suggestions that we can hand out to one another in order to recommend highly regarded music. I think it's great when a vast number of people can agree that an album is an essential masterpiece. It's so very rare, but it does exist. For instance, I'd say that 95% of people on P.A adore GENESIS's SELLING ENGLAND BY THE POUND and a lot of you on this web forum would reccomend that album to a new listener to prog. You know, something to break the ice for the new listener. I would be Inclined to do this myself, but I know it's not always gonna work. An example is that my firend wanted to know more about prog and wanted to get an idea of what a highly regarded, Masterpiece of a prog album would sound like. I started him off with 3 progressive gems (my opinion only.) they were,
1) AQUALUNG -Jethro Tull 2) DARKSIDE OF THE MOON-Pink Floyd and the 3rd one I suggested to diversify things was PARALLELS-Fates Warning, which is a very accessible prog/metal album. Anyway. To my amazement, my friend ended up liking the fates warning the best...by far! Actually, Hated the other 2! All in all my point is that recommending what we think is a masterpiece could very well be a generational thing, which is why it's very hard to quantify music in general. My friend is 32 years old and I through in that Fates album recommendation largely because of his age. It ended up working.   

Also. There were some other points being brought up in this forum about how many Masterpieces some of you felt you owned out of your extensive music collection. This is again subjective, but still very interesting. I would here exact numbers like 30, 45 or even % of how much their music collection are masterpieces. Others have even said in this thread that they even save their masterpiece albums for when the timing is right. I find this so incredibly interesting because this is something I cannot do altogether regarding these points. First of all, when I am really in the mood to listen to a certain album I just go for it! I don't save it. Why torture yourself in that way by listening to something else that is mediocre just because you either haven't listen to it in a while or are building up towards the masterpiece you want to listen to. My point is don't torture yourself!!! If you really want to listen to a particular album that you love as a masterpiece than listen to it! Do it a 100 times if you want. A lot of decerning music heads out there, including myself, will tell you that the reason why we have such large music collections is to fill the void of different parts of our moods. The point being, if you love a certain album and your craving it listen to it at that moment! Your mood could change and the passion could be lost subjecting yourself to mediocre prog in the process to your self. Don't settle for mediocrity!!! It doesn't humble you or help diversify your music tastes. Your just torturing yourself from what you really want to listen to, ultimately taking the joy out of music. Beware of what is mediocre to you and don't give in just becaus should feel you have to. :)

Dayvenkirq wrote: HarbouringTheSoul wrote: Dayvenkirq wrote: If you really think it's just about the impact, read the rules and guidelines. I assume by "impact" you mean "enjoyment". Anyway, I have read the rules and guidelines and they say nothing about the matter. They caution against using too many five-star ratings because not every album you enjoy is a masterpiece. But that is compatible with what I'm saying. Whatever you meant by impact.

I used the word "impact" in this context: "I don't buy into the notion that an album that had no impact on the prog scene whatsoever can't be a masterpiece." In other words, I think it's precisely not about the impact.

Dayvenkirq wrote: 1) One of the ideas here is to use five stars sparingly, and that's done for a reason.

I use five stars sparingly. There are few albums I love that much.

Dayvenkirq wrote: If you really think it's just about the impact, read the rules and guidelines.

I assume by "impact" you mean "enjoyment". Anyway, I have read the rules and guidelines and they say nothing about the matter. They caution against using too many five-star ratings because not every album you enjoy is a masterpiece. But that is compatible with what I'm saying.

Slartibartfast wrote: Why must you listen to mediocre prog even if you are a collector?

Edited by tamijo - November 09 2012 at 06:48

"Usual suspects" referred to the most historically significant prog albums. It just so happens that they're also the most popular ones.

Nobody spoke of popularity.

Dayvenkirq wrote: Consider all the other factors that make a masterwork what it is: novelty, the extent of progginess, its historical importance, etc.

None of these have anything to do with "masterpiece" status. If that were the case, I could only give five stars to the usual suspects: Close to the Edge, Thick as a Brick, Foxtrot etc. I don't buy into the notion that an album that had no impact on the prog scene whatsoever can't be a masterpiece.

HarbouringTheSoul wrote: lazland wrote: Some people are in the mindset that something they find extremely enjoyable is, de facto, a masterpiece. It ain't. I would call an album I find extremely and consistently enjoyable a masterpiece. What else is a masterpiece if not that?

Edited by Dayvenkirq - November 08 2012 at 21:55