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Topic ClosedProg-metal for people who don't like prog-metal

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micky View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Prog-metal for people who don't like prog-metal
    Posted: March 24 2007 at 01:57
Originally posted by Peter Rideout

Well, re your comparison to Italian prog vocals, then, Michelangelo, I'd have to disagree.

I find PFM vocals to be rather nice, Banco vox to be dynamic, and even the intense Latin vox of Deus Ex Machina to be musical, but I find growled vox to be very irritating, and just plain (unintentionally) funny. I think these bands seriously limit the possible extent of their audience when they employ them. (My wife -- kids too -- and friends would think I was NUTS if I played that stuff for them, and said I liked the singing. I honestly can't imagine anyone I know personally enjoying -- or even tolerating -- that.)

Again, I'm not saying you'd have to be nuts to like it ("different strokes," & all), but I'd need to be someone else to get into it. I have enough trouble with screamers like Axel Rose & the guy from ACDC (make me unable to enjoy the otherwise pretty good, ass-kickin' tunes), but growling, to me, takes it to a whole new level of pain -- the lowest level of hell, perhaps. If there are angel choirs in heaven, and demonic choruses in hell, the latter must sound just like the above vocals.
Not at all pleasant, shall we say....Ermm

Ermm I hope I don't get in trouble in certain quarters for this post -- I'm just being honest.

Again, there was some good, even pretty/uplifting music on there, though -- well-deserving of the "prog" label.Smile




LOL you go Peter!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2007 at 02:17
Originally posted by micky

 

LOL you go Peter!


Er, yes -- to bed!Sleepy

Is it past 2:00 AM there too?

Furschluginner Archives!Angry You did it to me again! Ouch
Let the monkey drive.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2007 at 02:17
ah, nice to hear from you Bryan. I'm an old 'head from way back and got into music through NWOBHM, so I'm all for this thread. Much of the metal we loved as kids was complex and progressive before progmetal was a term, like Maiden, Angelwitch and Voivod.. and in S.F. we had Metallica and other great acts.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2007 at 04:28
hahhahah.. sort of funny Peter speaking of the thread topic..  in revenge for subjecting Raff to one of Battiato's out of this world electronic adventures she put on a PM album she bought last night.  Actually it isn't bad at all.  I guess the flip side of the cookie monster vocals.. the female fronted groups.. wasn't bad at all. Would never pull the album out on my own. But listenable..  I think I'm actually hearing some cello as I type this..

The Gathering - Mandylion
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2007 at 16:50
Really I care, Bryan. Don't worry, I don't HATE any kind of music. Music is for everything!

Thanks, anyway.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 25 2007 at 03:44
Originally posted by The T

Originally posted by FruMp

I HATE emotion deprived cheese bands like DT who have modern metal production, that is my most hated type of prog alongside prog/power.

I'm sure there are a lot of guys here like me who like metal and prog but hate cheese, if  you're one of those guys I recommend you get some:
 
Let's see.....

Atheist - kickass technical prog metal most importantly with sweet riffs, amazing rythmn section, funky ass drum beats and bass lines. Unquestionable presence is more technical and more metallic, elements is a bit slower and more prog - both highly, highly recommended. But you said you hate emotion-deprived bands... yet you don't count emotion as one of your reccomended band's attributes...Confused
Death - a similar band, highly repsected early death metal band some great stuff but they're a bit heavier, their later stuff (symbolic onwards) is more prog and technical mmmm, the same thing again.
Coroner - absolutely freaking amazing 80's technical thrash power trio if you're into sweet technical riffs, breakneck speed extremely tasteful (and fast) solos then get some  they aren't on the archives though, I'd recommend punishment for decadence for the metal fan and grin for the prog fan.No emotion at all... Pure technique, according to you. So I understand that what you really hate is emotion, don't you?
Mekong Delta - Amazing band plays thrash infused with classical music (not cheese neo-classical sh*te either, PROPER classical stuff), I recommend visions fugitivesWhat is that "neo-classic" sh*t? What is PROPER classical? True PROPER classical would be music straight from the wombs of Mozart or Haydn or Carl Phillip Emannuel Bach... that's the only TRUE classical music, becuase the expression "classical music", if we are to use it properly, refers only to that period of time after the baroque and before romanticism... but we all agree to call all academic music "classical", so I guess either all of these bands play PROPER classical music or they don't
Spastik Ink - Highly amusing instrumental (mostly) very technical prog metal band, interesting stuff, either of their albums are worth a listen.
Mr Bungle - not terribly metal (even though they were THE band that got me into metal) but a bloody excellent and funny band.
Sleep Terror - Awesome Techincal Metal duo, really good stuff has lots of jazz breaks and technical ass riffs in it.
Right.. All of these great bands... but yopu hate emotion deprived metal...Confused

I mean even some earlier thrash stuff is quite progressive if you listen hard
I agree.

Metallica - master of puppets, I'm not the biggest fan of metallica but master of puppets the song is undeniably progressive in nature and it's arguably their best and most adventurous album.Agreeance it's the word.
Megadeth - when you analyse the song structures they are often quite progessive in nature, Rust in piece is highly recommended,  mustaine writes kickass riffs holy wars I believe is quite a progessive song with some kinda technical riffs, kickass song.Don't agree that much... Even Rust in Peace is pure giitar fireworks..good album but it's just thrash...
Lawnmower deth - obscure band that I've got into recently, really funny RIO type thrash but it's more straightforward - only recommended for metal fans.

God I could be here all day digging and probing and finding prog elements in all the bands I like, I'll just stop now.


Basically I'm equally a fan of prog and thrash these days, I can't speak highly enough of the thrash metal genre there is so much quality music to be had and it's just got this real raw and genuine feel to it most of the time and there are some really good funny bands and real good innovators it's all mostly from the 80's though. So yeah that's the kinda guy these opinions are coming from.I understand. But you'd agree you are not a "emotional" band kind of fan, from what you say and from the list you are giving.... so, how come you know DT is a emotion-deprived band?...ConfusedConfused
 
Anyway, I respect your position. But, to use an expression I just love (please, I HAVE the right to use it at least once in my lifetime):.........
 
You just don't get it.
 
Big%20smileWink 



Well I have to disagree with you that I don't get it I mean if I didn't like emotionally stimulating music why would close to the edge be my favourite song of all time?, why would I love dark side of the moon?, why am I going through an italian prog phase?

Well I emplore you to listen to those bands before judging them, the thing about metal is you really need to 'get' it in and be open to it in order to be able to dervie emotional benefit from it, and being a thrash fan of course I'm going to want blazing fast kickass riffs and bitchin' solos but I don't get into bands who are JUST that, the bands that appeal to me are the bands that have good well written music foremost then all the rest of it later - if you want I can upload some of the music I mentioned so you can see for yourself, or you could go listen to it on their page on the archives, I recommend mother man by atheist.

and the reason I and probably many others think DT are emotion deprived is because the vocals and lyrics are in my opinion cheesy the guitar is a lot of the time over the top and unnecesary shred and it doesn't seem genuine when petrucci slows down and plays something 'emotional' it seems like it's just theory recital and not from the heart (oh god I sound like a douche saying that XD), it seems too clean to me as well, I mean you think about some of the most emotional and best prog works and they aren't clean and clear cut, they have a lot of nuances and an organic feel (probably attributed to analog production) take close to the edge for example.

It's just an opinion that DT are cheesy, emotion depreived and superficial just as it's just an opinion that the metal bands I like aren't just mindless technical shred, in the end the opinion that DT are all of the above is one that I and many others hold for much of the same reasons, and it's not really exclusively hate for DT it's more a dislike of modern prog metal and power metal, and it's hard to deny that a lot of it is cheesy as hell.


Edited by FruMp - March 25 2007 at 12:26
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Bryan View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 28 2007 at 01:31
Originally posted by micky

hahhahah.. sort of funny Peter speaking of the thread topic..  in revenge for subjecting Raff to one of Battiato's out of this world electronic adventures she put on a PM album she bought last night.  Actually it isn't bad at all.  I guess the flip side of the cookie monster vocals.. the female fronted groups.. wasn't bad at all. Would never pull the album out on my own. But listenable..  I think I'm actually hearing some cello as I type this..

The Gathering - Mandylion


The Gathering are definitely a band I could see people not so friendly towards prog-metal gain some appreciation for... I'm not a big fan of theirs personally, but they're certainly on the less abraisive end of the metal spectrum.

Anyway, for anybody actually interested in hearing some new music as a result of this thread:

Band: Tyr
Album: Ragnarok
PA Link coming soon...
Samples: http://www.tyr.net/cddisco.asp?Cmd=2
Viking themed metal from the Faroe Islands??  As bizarre as the idea behind this band seems, they're undeniably one of the prog-metal world's rising stars.  Taking a base of traditional heavy metal and interjecting it with some healthy doses of prog rock's best bits (epic conceptual themes, interesting song developments, creative approaches to songwriting) while avoiding the worse ones (there are no overly lengthy songs or pointless instrumental w**kfests to be found, though the band's instrumental sections are nothing short of impressive) and throwing on a steady dose of Farosian (?) folk music to create a truly unique final result.  In fact, arguably the finest moments on the entire album come when the band turns in soaring, inpsiring metal adaptations of their homeland's traditional folk songs, which we're treated to a few of.  The original compositions are magnificent and feature a stronger focus on songwriting than most prog-metal groups, with most of the inherent technicality appearing more on a subtle level.  Not overly heavy, fantastic yet suitably controlled lead vocals (don't expect any of James LaBrie's dramatic off-key theatrics) and enough songwriting depth to keep you noticing new things each listen, these guys are seriously worth investing some time in for pretty much any fan of prog.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 28 2007 at 01:34
just picked up Indukti's SUSAR.. completely satisfied, it's terrific!

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 28 2007 at 02:13
^^ I really like Tyr, but I have to say that Ragnarok is not as prog as the previous album ... it's only prog-related IMO, so if anybody want's to check them out and expects to find prog - get Eric the Red instead of Ragnarok.Smile
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 28 2007 at 10:04
Looking forward to that addition, Bryan!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 16 2007 at 09:26
Very good thread,Bryan - I dislike traditional Heavy/Power-based Prog-Metal, but bands like TOOL, PELICAN, INDUKTI, OPETH, MY DYING BRIDE are among my favouritest ones! Keep it going!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 02 2007 at 03:18
Opeth, Ayreon,POS are my favourite prog metal bands.I like Tyr, too.And Borknagar Tongue
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 05 2007 at 21:03
Lately I've been fascinated with Grayceon, which are a guitar/cello/drums/vocals (female and male) trio. The sound is sort of raw and it has this free spirit, but every note is in place. The cello gives the muic a great atmosphere, and beyond the metal (which is not the main focus here, as I see it) you get some great progressive rock here (granted, a heavier kind of rock).
 
Here are some links:
http://www.myspace.com/grayceon (2 songs to listen to)
http://www.grayceon.com/ official website with samples
http://www.vendlus.com/artists/grayceon/ theeir page at their label's website
http://nocturnalcult.com/ interview and review
 
Another one to look to (although heavier, and with what some might see as unpleasant vocals) is Giant Squid:
 
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 05 2007 at 21:09
^^^^  I agree with this recommendation. Wonderful band. Wonderful music.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 23 2007 at 22:45
I'd definately recommend SubMasq as an amazing band for metal fans.
 
Dog Fashion Disco, is another interesting pick, somewhat in the vein of Mr. Bungle, but more metal oriented.  Silly and overraught, but in a good way.  They haven't been added, but I made a thread in the suggestions forum.
 
Maybe *cough*some one could go look at it...*cough*
[QUOTE=darkshade] [QUOTE=Sckxyss]
I'm disappointed - neither of these players are avant-garde!

Al di Meola.

[/QUOTE]

haha i know. but the poll itself is avant-garde
[/QUOTE]
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2007 at 22:08
About five months have passed since I got into this thread, causing some scandals related to likes and dislikes about PM. Well, I owe an apology because I was a new member joined at that time and I was a bit anxious to create discussions and fights and all that.......

Why am I posting here again? To resurface this dead thread, a very good one (and I'm not being hypocrite; despite my rude commentaries in the past, I'm sure I said that anyway), because I'm getting into prog metal..... errr...... more deeply I'd say. More than before, surely. It's not an easy task, but I'm trying. Hardly.

Among those bands of the genre that I liked it, I can count Ayreon (I've only heard The Human Equation), Green Carnation (The Acoustic Verses for now), some stuff from Riverside, Opeth (Damnation, great album), still not into DT's Scenes from a Memory but interesting enough...... and, specially, the last recommendation by Bryan: Neurosis - The Eye of Every Storm. Good stuff.

As you can see, I'm trying to start. Going very careful though, but I'm being guided ok. Anathema seems to be my next parade.

You metal progheads, tell me if the bands aforementioned are in fact PM for people who don't like PM, aren't they?


Edited by sircosick - August 26 2007 at 22:09
The best you can is good enough...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2007 at 23:29
Hey man, glad to hear you're starting to come around. Big%20smile

Those are definitely good bands to start with, when I started this thread I was trying to focus on bands most prog people might not have heard of but that's not to hold anything against the likes of Ayreon, Green Carnation, Opeth and Riverside (all bands I enjoy quite a bit).  Anathema is definitely a good next choice, also maybe check out Orphaned Land.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 11 2007 at 22:13
Smile

In this precise moment, listening to Sieges Even (A sense of change). Really paying an important attention to it. Not bad. I'll check out Orphaned Land. Thanks.
The best you can is good enough...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 16 2007 at 21:37
bah prog-metal bands nowadays are all dream theater ripoffs...except the ones i havnet listned to

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 16 2007 at 21:48
Originally posted by activetopics

bah prog-metal bands nowadays are all dream theater ripoffs...except the ones i havnet listned to

Which means you don't know what you're talking about. Not one of the bands mentioned in this thread is a DT ripoff. As a matter of fact, that's why this thread was created. Perhaps if you tried some of the bands listed here you might revise your broad, uninformed statement. Wink
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